Emma Myers (00:02): They are both really weird and I feel like nobody else will ever understand each other as much as they do because they're both at the same level of weird.

Caitlin Reilly (00:17): I'm Caitlin Reilly, and welcome back to the Wednesday Season Two Official Woecast. I am over the moon to welcome the one, the only Emma Myers, aka Enid Sinclair, the amazing incomparable Gwendoline Christie is back as Professor Weems and Al Gough and Miles Millar are here to take us behind the scenes of episode six, including how they pulled off the big body swap. Dang, aren't we supposed to have music playing? Thanks, buddy. I am over the moon to welcome our next guest, a rainbow of light herself, Enid Sinclair. It's Emma Myers.

Emma Myers (01:08): Hello.

Caitlin Reilly (01:09): Hello. Thank you for being here today.

Emma Myers (01:10): Thanks for having me.

Caitlin Reilly (01:12): We are seeing Enid in a different light this season. She's fully wolfed out. She spent the summer with her wolf pack.

Emma Myers (01:19): Mm-hmm.

Caitlin Reilly (01:20): How do you think she's changed from the last school year to this school year?

Emma Myers (01:25): I think Enid is still herself, but I think she's grown up a lot, especially wolfing out, I feel like it was a big deal for her.

Caitlin Reilly (01:35): Mm-hmm.

Emma Myers (01:37): And then getting to be a part of the community that she's always wanted to be a part of is life changing for her. She hangs out with the pack now, she's got a new boyfriend, and although she's not insecure as much as she used to be, I feel like there's still an insecure aspect to her about, okay, now I do fit in with the pack. Now I kind of have to keep that up and make sure that I'm perfect and I stay in there. So I feel like although she's grown up and changed and matured a lot, I feel like she's still her little scared self. Yeah.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): I just didn't expect my relationship with Bruno to heat up so quickly. I mean, we literally skipped right past the talking phase. I just don't know how to break things off with Ajax.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): A quick blow to the head should suffice.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): I don't want to hurt his feelings. It's not his fault we grew apart over the summer.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): Didn't Divina borrow your swimsuit top?

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): Oh my God, maybe she did. Thank you, Wednesday.

Caitlin Reilly (02:39): She was with Ajax last season. Now we have Bruno in the mix. So how do you think Enid's feeling about this love triangle that she's finding herself in?

Emma Myers (02:50): She's in a sort of sticky situation because you kind of can't help how you feel.

Caitlin Reilly (02:56): Of course.

Emma Myers (02:56): And you kind of can't help that you change your mind and you've grown up, and so that influences your decisions. And I think she still cares for Ajax and that's why I think she does the things that she does because she doesn't want to hurt his feelings, but in turn, doing what she does kind of does hurt his feelings. Also, I think Bruno excites her because he's a part of the life that she always wanted to have.He's a part of the Wolf pack.

Caitlin Reilly (03:29): And he's gorgeous.

Emma Myers (03:30): And he's gorgeous. Can't forget that.

Caitlin Reilly (03:34): Can't forget that.

Emma Myers (03:34): No. And yeah, so she finds herself in this kind of, I guess, perfect life that she wanted, but I think she's still very confused about a lot. I think it's kind of hard to know what you want until you're in that situation and it's hard to know what you don't want until you kind of have it.

[CLIP] Georgie Farmer (as Ajax Petropolus): You never gave me a heads-up. I wish we could have just talked about it before you moved on without me.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): I'm really sorry. I just didn't expect things with Bruno to heat up so fast.

[CLIP] Georgie Farmer (as Ajax Petropolus): You remember that day in Uriah's Heap? I guess squirrels and rats can't work out after all.

Caitlin Reilly (04:31): Why do you think that Enid chooses Bruno over Ajax? Do you realize that you've broken Ajax's heart?

Emma Myers (04:52): I know, I know. And it's awful.

Caitlin Reilly (04:53): He's beside himself. He's trying really hard to be nice to you.

Emma Myers (04:56): Yeah, I know. It's kind of awful. It's awful in the fact that she didn't let him know before she started seeing Bruno.

Caitlin Reilly (05:05): But a girl can do what she wants.

Emma Myers (05:07): A girl can do what she wants, but tell somebody. If you're moved on, tell the person.

Caitlin Reilly (05:15): Yeah, I guess that's the right thing to do.

Emma Myers (05:18): She always feels like Ajax was in love with the girl that she was before and she rejects that. She doesn't want to be that girl anymore. She goes with her gut on that and chooses Bruno, but it's not for a lack of having feelings for Ajax.

Caitlin Reilly (05:36): Maybe she'll change her mind down the line.

Emma Myers (05:38): Maybe.

Caitlin Reilly (05:38): Who knows?

Emma Myers (05:38): Who knows?

Caitlin Reilly (05:39): Maybe she's a little flip-flopper, right? Who knows?

Emma Myers (05:42): Can't blame her.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): I'm not sure how I feel about Ajax anymore. He's sweet and cute, but he's still in love with the old me and I've changed. Hey, look at that. Exactly 25 words.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): Just talk to him and get it over with.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): Yeah. Well if I do that, then it'll be like an arrow through his... Holy crap.

Caitlin Reilly (06:02): I wanted to touch on her dynamic with Wednesday. It's changed a lot. I mean, I feel like there's some tension, there's some distance. What do you think is going on there?

Emma Myers (06:16): I think it comes down to the fact that they don't really want to understand each other, even though they do.

Caitlin Reilly (06:22): Right.

Emma Myers (06:23): They think they do, but they're both really stubborn. They are both very stubborn people and I think they're both just really weird.

Caitlin Reilly (06:32): I mean, yeah.

Emma Myers (06:32): They're both really weird and I feel like nobody else will ever understand each other as much as they do because they're both at the same level of weird. Even though Enid claims that Wednesday's more weird than her, I think Enid's just as weird.

Caitlin Reilly (06:49): I think Enid's pretty weird.

Emma Myers (06:50): And at the end of the day, it kind of takes things getting a little shaken up in order for them to fully reconcile and have everything out there.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): The sooner I get answers, the sooner I can save Enid.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): Wednesday?

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): Who I currently want to murder.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): Didn't you see the scrunchie on the door? That's kind of universal roomie code for do not disturb.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): You know I'm not above using a nail gun?

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): How long have you been here?

[CLIP] Evie Templeton (as Agnes DeMille): Somewhere between... And hmm. I'm definitely scarred.

[CLIP] Noah B. Taylor (as Bruno Yuson): Let's go.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): Stay out of my room, you little creep.

Caitlin Reilly (07:37): I wanted to talk about Agnes. She's a huge addition to this season. What was it like working with Evie and watching her bring that character to life? I mean, she's such an incredible addition. It's like a little Powerpuff Girls trio.

Emma Myers (07:51): Evie is probably one of the most talented young actors that I've ever worked with. She's so good and she's so professional and she really just understands everything. She gets it. And even Jenna and I were talking about this when she was cast. She's like, oh, she's been there this whole time. It doesn't even feel like she's new. She's such a cool person. I love her to death. She's also very funny and very sweet and very different from her character.

Caitlin Reilly (08:21): How so?

Emma Myers (08:22): Well, she's got such a pleasant demeanor and is so kind and so soft-spoken. And even though Agnes is just a little creepy and a little bit weird, but she's such a delight to work with. I felt like our scenes together were so cool because she was giving it her all. She's got such a good character.

Caitlin Reilly (08:43): Yeah. How do you think having Agnes in the dynamic changes things?

Emma Myers (08:47): It definitely starts the kind of tension between Enid and Wednesday because Enid feels replaced and she's always been insecure about not fitting in and not getting to keep her friends. And I think when Agnes comes in, and Wednesday's really fine with her tagging along, I think that really hurts Enid a lot. Because all she wants is Wednesday's attention, and it shakes things up a little bit. But I think that it's what they needed. Because at the end, their dynamic as the trio is so good, and I think they're all what each other needs. And she's a good addition, even though in the beginning it was rocky.

Caitlin Reilly (09:29): You know who wants Enid's attention? Ajax.

Emma Myers (09:34): It's true. But doesn't everybody want Enid's attention?

Caitlin Reilly (09:37): Yeah. Well, Noah Tyler too.

Emma Myers (09:40): Yeah.

Caitlin Reilly (09:41): What was it like creating that dynamic with him? Little romance moments.

Emma Myers (09:46): He's so good. He is so charming, and he plays it really well on screen. And even though he told me, "I'm nervous for this scene, I'm so nervous," you cannot tell, at all.

Caitlin Reilly (10:00): Not at all.

Emma Myers (10:00): He comes across so confident, so sure of himself.

Caitlin Reilly (10:06): Having little romance moments in front of a room of 20 people with cameras is-

Emma Myers (10:10): It's quite awkward.

Caitlin Reilly (10:11): It's scary, yeah.

Emma Myers (10:13): It's scary and it's awkward. And I remember our first kiss scene we had wasn't on the schedule that day, but we had to call for weather cover. And so they switched up the schedule really fast on us, because we couldn't shoot outside. And so they were like, "Well, you guys got to do your scene now." I felt awful, because sometimes it's nerve wracking, especially being thrown into it really fast when you weren't prepared. But Tim is really funny about it. Tim was like, "Yeah, you guys just... You kiss for a little bit, but I won't watch, it's fine. I'll just give you a few seconds, and then I'll say stop."

Caitlin Reilly (10:57): He's the on-set dad.

Emma Myers (11:00): Yeah. I don't think Tim really likes to watch those scenes, to be honest.

Caitlin Reilly (11:03): Well, of course not.

Emma Myers (11:04): Yeah. He always goes through them really fast.

Caitlin Reilly (11:07): That's so funny.

Emma Myers (11:08): Yeah.

[CLIP] Noah B. Taylor (as Bruno Yuson): Enid, hey. I was just talking to my mom in the Philippines.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Wednesday Addams): You and your mother are awfully close. [speaks Tagalog]. Or was that really your girlfriend back home that you failed to mention in an act of time-honored misogynistic deception?

[CLIP] Noah B. Taylor (as Bruno Yuson): How do you know Tagalog?

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Wednesday Addams): I picked it up when I was eight from Datu, my Filipino fencing instructor. He also taught me how to castrate with a bolo knife.

Caitlin Reilly (11:39): Episode six is the Swapping Bodies episode which, excuse me, is my favorite episode. You guys swap bodies full Freaky Friday. I want to talk about that for a second. What was it like filming that?

Emma Myers (11:50): What happened was we would get each other's sides, and we would film each other doing us as normal. She would be reading Wednesday trapped in Enid's body.

Caitlin Reilly (12:01): I see.

Emma Myers (12:02): And then she would send me that video. I did the same with her. We had a few rehearsals together to map out our scenes that we have together. So the scene where we wake up in the dorm and we're in each other's bodies. The scene where we're walking down the stairs in the quad, and then our scene in the graveyard where the swap happens, and then we go back to normal. That was the extent of our physical rehearsals together. Most of it was just videos sent to one another.

Caitlin Reilly (12:32): Oh, wow. So one was not on set for the other.

Emma Myers (12:35): Yeah, yeah.

Caitlin Reilly (12:35): I feel like that would've made things complicated.

Emma Myers (12:38): It would've been complicated, because we were also doing three units at the time and so everybody's everywhere. But it was very helpful when we both had a scene together, because we were watching each other in the scene. And then when we would cut, we'd say, "Hey, you could actually probably do this and it would maybe make it more-"

Caitlin Reilly (12:57): So you're directing each other in a way that feels safe?

Emma Myers (13:00): Almost. Almost, yeah.

Caitlin Reilly (13:01): Yeah.

Emma Myers (13:02): I hate doing that, because I don't like critiquing people's performances.

Caitlin Reilly (13:07): Right. But you almost have to.

Emma Myers (13:09): You have to. And Jenna was so good about it too. She was like, "Seriously, if there is anything that I'm not doing right, tell me and I'll fix it." And so we both swapped notes like that in our scenes, which was really good. The problem is when you don't have each other on set-

Caitlin Reilly (13:26): You're kind of out for pasture.

Emma Myers (13:28): You're lost.

Caitlin Reilly (13:28): Yeah.

Emma Myers (13:29): And so we'd just re-watch our videos. But also we would pull up... Our director, Angela, for that block, pulled up season one on her laptop, and so we would sit there and watch the way that Jenna walks across a big room, or the way that she holds her head or how she turns her body. We tried to be very specific when we didn't have each other on set, because that's when I feel like it got the hardest.

Caitlin Reilly (13:58): Right.

Emma Myers (13:58): Yeah.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Enid Sinclair): What are we going to do?

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Wednesday Addams): We tell absolutely no one. This must remain our secret.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Enid Sinclair): And you need to stay away from Bruno.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Wednesday Addams): And you must avoid my family at all cost, especially my mother.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Enid Sinclair): We got this, right? How hard is it to act like Wednesday Addams?

Caitlin Reilly (14:17): I also noticed that you didn't blink.

Emma Myers (14:19): No.

Caitlin Reilly (14:21): You mastered it, girl.

Emma Myers (14:22): I, well-

Caitlin Reilly (14:23): Really hard to do.

Emma Myers (14:24): It's so hard.

Caitlin Reilly (14:24): You didn't blink as Wednesday.

Emma Myers (14:25): I have a trick for it though, because-

Caitlin Reilly (14:27): What's the trick?

Emma Myers (14:28): Well, my first few days of shooting it, it was miserable. They had to cut around it, because I literally could not keep my eyes open. We were outside, and it was windy and my eyes were watering and it was miserable. And so Jenna was telling me, Hey, blink when it's not your line, and they'll cut around you because they'll probably cut to me. Well, I found out that when I have my contacts in, I can keep my eyes open-

Caitlin Reilly (14:50): Makes it harder.

Emma Myers (14:51): ... for minutes on end. Because you don't feel any air on your eyes.

Caitlin Reilly (14:55): Right.

Emma Myers (14:55): So all I had to do was then put my contacts in and I could keep my eyes open the entire scene, and wouldn't have an issue. I don't know how she does it without contacts because she doesn't wear any.

Caitlin Reilly (15:05): I asked her about it, and I think there's just some otherworldly thing happening in that girl's body that allows her to do it.

Emma Myers (15:12): I think she's just really talented, and yeah.

Caitlin Reilly (15:13): Yeah.

Emma Myers (15:14): It's crazy.

Caitlin Reilly (15:15): I know. That was the first thing I noticed and I was like, "Oh my gosh, she's not blinking."

Emma Myers (15:18): I was trying so hard.

Caitlin Reilly (15:19): You did it, girl, you did it.

Emma Myers (15:21): But when you're staring for that long with your eyes open, your vision gets really blurry. So half the time I would be talking to somebody, and then it would go cross-eyed and I couldn't see what was happening.

Caitlin Reilly (15:31): Of course.

Emma Myers (15:32): You just try and do all your action without being able to see.

Caitlin Reilly (15:35): It would be remiss if I didn't touch on Lady Gaga.

Emma Myers (15:39): Gaga.

Caitlin Reilly (15:41): Lady Gaga. Lady Gaga, coming in as Rosalind Rotwood.

Emma Myers (15:45): My goodness.

Caitlin Reilly (15:46): What was it like seeing her embody that character on set? Hello?

Emma Myers (15:51): Well, fun fact, I actually did not film my scene with her. She did all of her coverage on a green screen, because they just animated her face onto the statue.

Caitlin Reilly (16:03): Okay, so then what have you heard?

Emma Myers (16:05): So I saw her footage, right?

Caitlin Reilly (16:08): Mm-hmm.

Emma Myers (16:09): And it was really good, so I had to go based off of that, off of her footage. But I met her, and she's wonderful.

Caitlin Reilly (16:16): I'm sure.

Emma Myers (16:16): She's lovely.

Caitlin Reilly (16:17): The best.

Emma Myers (16:18): So sweet, so chill and down to earth.

Caitlin Reilly (16:20): What does she smell like? We'll talk about that later.

Emma Myers (16:23): I don't know.

Caitlin Reilly (16:24): We'll talk about that later.

Emma Myers (16:25): Yeah, yeah.

Caitlin Reilly (16:25): It's fine, just tell me in secret.

Emma Myers (16:26): It's a secret, it's a secret.

Caitlin Reilly (16:26): Tell me a secret.

Emma Myers (16:27): It's a secret.

Caitlin Reilly (16:27): Oh, sweet.

Emma Myers (16:28): Yeah.

Caitlin Reilly (16:28): Well thank you so much, Emma.

Emma Myers (16:30): Thank you.

Caitlin Reilly (16:30): Enid Sinclair herself, it was so lovely to talk to you.

Emma Myers (16:33): It was lovely being here, thank you for having me.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Enid Sinclair): Why am I staring at me?

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Wednesday Addams): Because we've somehow swapped bodies.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Enid Sinclair): I don't understand. We were at the graveyard, and now we're here and now it's morning. How the hell did that happen?

[CLIP] Gwendoline Christie (as Larissa Weems): You broke the Raven's gaze. Now it's playing a dirty trick.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Wednesday Addams): How do we swap back?

[CLIP] Gwendoline Christie (as Larissa Weems): You always think you're the smartest person in the room. I'll let you figure that one out.

[GFX: Coming Up Next]

Caitlin Reilly (17:07): There is so much more to come. I will be rejoined by co-creators and co-showrunners Alan Miles. But first, we love a comeback, right? I am so excited to have with me the OG Nevermore principal herself, Larissa Weems. Mrs. Gwendoline Christie, hello.

Gwendoline Christie (17:28): Hello.

Caitlin Reilly (17:29): Thank you for being here.

Gwendoline Christie (17:31): Thank you very much for having me.

Caitlin Reilly (17:32): You look gorgeous as ever.

Gwendoline Christie (17:33): Thank you, right back at you.

Caitlin Reilly (17:35): Oh my gosh, Gwendoline, stop. Now, the last time we saw Principal Weems, she was brutally murdered by Marilyn Thornhill.

Gwendoline Christie (17:46): That is correct.

Caitlin Reilly (17:47): And now she's back in season two, which is a fantastic shock.

Gwendoline Christie (17:50): Apparently so.

Caitlin Reilly (17:51): So when did you find out you were doing season two?

Gwendoline Christie (17:54): Well, Miles and Al spoke to me before we finished shooting season one, but at the end of season one.

Caitlin Reilly (18:01): Okay.

Gwendoline Christie (18:01): And it had been one of those rare things where there's the scent of electricity in the air. I just really sort of fell in love with everybody there. It's such an incredible cast and great writing, and Tim's such a magical director that the whole experience was very exciting for me and very unlike anything I'd quite done before, or any part I'd played before. So I was very warmed by that idea. Initially the attraction had been that it was only one season because I wanted to do a range of other things, and having worked for a long time doing series, I just wanted to move around and do a range of different things and play different parts. But I became intoxicated by the role and by the brilliant people I was working with. So they mentioned it and then the sort of much-longed-for thing occurred, which was that the show was a hit and I was so delighted for everybody because they worked so hard through often difficult circumstances. And then it came up that they would like Weems to come back.

[CLIP] Gwendoline Christie (as Larissa Weems): The tantalizing prospect of tormenting you from beyond the grave was just too delicious to pass up. Now you've certainly been a busy bee. Just a recap. You lost your psychic ability.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): Only after I mastered it.

[CLIP] Gwendoline Christie (as Larissa Weems): You lied to your one and only friend, Enid Sinclair about her impending doom.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): I was protecting her.

[CLIP] Gwendoline Christie (as Larissa Weems): And the coup de grace, freeing Tyler Galpin, a homicidal hide from a high-security psychiatric institution.

Caitlin Reilly (19:42): Well, I wanted to talk about the dynamic between Wednesday and Weems. Obviously they couldn't be more different, but there's a connection happening, there's a camaraderie taking place. I wanted to talk about that. Talk about what it was like working with Jenna through that and what you found and what you discovered.

Gwendoline Christie (20:01): It's a funny thing, isn't it? I suppose it's chemistry.

Caitlin Reilly (20:06): Chemistry-

Gwendoline Christie (20:07): But it's a rare thing-

Caitlin Reilly (20:10): ... which is hard.

Gwendoline Christie (20:10): It is a rare thing though.

Caitlin Reilly (20:10): Yes.

Gwendoline Christie (20:11): It's a rare thing, and it comes along, and it's undeniable, and it's effortless. And I was so impressed by Jenna the first time I worked with her. So impressed by her focus. It's also a delight to work with her in the scenes because she brings all of herself to them. She brings all of her focus, all of her seriousness about the part, about the role, about the script, about the scenario, about the day. And it's a great relief actually to be able to just enter that space with another actor and have absolutely no issue whatsoever about pushing each other's buttons. Because fundamentally, you respect each other and you care about each other.

Caitlin Reilly (21:02): And you feel safe.

Gwendoline Christie (21:03): You have great love. And when you have that, it means that you can really move it about many different places. I mean, it's not great to be in season one to be so angry and threatening towards such a young woman, but Jenna gives life to the circumstance, and that allows me to take great pleasure in taking it where it needs to go because it is just fun. It's just enjoyable.

[CLIP] Gwendoline Christie (as Larissa Weems): Your ability is inextricably tied to who you are. You abused it.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): You sound like my mother.

[CLIP] Gwendoline Christie (as Larissa Weems): Sticks and stones, except I have no bones.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): I'm done being lectured.

[CLIP] Gwendoline Christie (as Larissa Weems): Then wake up.

Caitlin Reilly (21:49): Now, Weems is watching something crazy happen, which is her job being taken over by somebody else.So Weems is seeing Principal Dort be the new principal. She's having to witness this. How do you think she feels about it and what was it like working with Steve Buscemi?

Gwendoline Christie (22:09): Steve?

Caitlin Reilly (22:09): Steve, a dear friend of the pod.

Gwendoline Christie (22:12): I've loved Steve Buscemi for a very long time. I'm a huge fan of a film he did called Tree's Lounge.

Caitlin Reilly (22:18): My favorite Steve Buscemi movie is Ghost World. Have you seen Ghost World?

Gwendoline Christie (22:22): Of course.

Caitlin Reilly (22:22): It's incredible.

Gwendoline Christie (22:23): Of course.

Caitlin Reilly (22:23): Yes.

Gwendoline Christie (22:24): He's such a sensational actor and he's been so inspiring through the years. He really is able to tread a line between reality and humor. He's a really extraordinary person. He really is, and just such a great and very particular performer. There's no one else quite like him. When I read the script, I could see that there was a huge amount of humor in Weems having her job taken away and of being humiliated. But I didn't really see it that way. I don't think anybody that has died and is fortunate enough to come back to life, would find it in any way entertaining, having their memory belittled and being treated cruelly.

Caitlin Reilly (23:03): Right. Naturally.

Gwendoline Christie (23:05): So it was quite easy to play the reality of that because also for me, there is a certain amount of the actor's care in there. Of genuinely hugely caring about this project and actually really not wanting to be replaced. And so there was a great similarity there, between Weems and I, of the deep pain of being rejected. And I remember this scene we did with Steve and Jenna the first time I see Dort. As an actress, it's much more exciting to see what you uncover on the day, but in no way had I planned any sort of particular emotion for that scene, but I cried because it was-

Caitlin Reilly (23:54): You did?

Gwendoline Christie (23:55): Weems did because I realized how much it mattered to her, and how, if you give even part of your life over to something, and put everything in it to make it as good as it possibly can be, the way Weems has done with Nevermore. The institution that she grew up in and she lived in, and then came to be in charge of, and try to implement changes and do the very best whilst actually sort of almost psychotically behaving in whatever way is necessary to get the outcome that she wants. There's a surprising emotionality that comes along with that. And I think also Weems is sort of disgusted by how gauche and what a charlatan Dort is.

Caitlin Reilly (24:38): Gwendoline, it was so lovely to speak with you today. You had amazing things to say, and I'm so glad that we're going to lunch this week.

Gwendoline Christie (24:47): Thank you.

Caitlin Reilly (24:47): Thank you.

Gwendoline Christie (24:48): Lunch is on you.

Caitlin Reilly (24:49): Oh, okay. Lunch is on me. Principal Weems, Gwendoline Christie.

Gwendoline Christie (24:55): Thank you.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): One more question. How do you plan on honoring the late principal Weems tonight?

[CLIP] Steve Buscemi (as Principal Barry Dort) Honor, I've spent months trying to expunge that woman's memory from every student and every donor's mind. She lingers like the smell of rancid brie.

[CLIP] Gwendoline Christie (as Larissa Weems): After everything I've done to burnish his school's reputation.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): There's your honest assessment.

[GFX: Meanwhile in the studio…]

Caitlin Reilly (25:27): Dang jeez. That was so loud, dude. You can't get good staff these days anywhere. Sorry. Sorry. I know it was a mistake. I am delighted to be joined once again by co-creators, co-showrunners, and executive producers Al Gough and Miles Millar. Thank you for coming back.

Miles Millar (25:52): Thank you.

Caitlin Reilly (25:53): Now the big Body Swap episode, which was so fun to see. Where did the idea come from to do this?

Alfred Gough (26:01): It's actually an idea that came late in the game.

Caitlin Reilly (26:04): Interesting.

Alfred Gough (26:04): Yeah, it was. We had come back after the writer's strike, and-

Miles Millar (26:10): Which interrupted this sort of writer's rooms-

Alfred Gough (26:12): The writer's room.

Miles Millar (26:13): So we came back. We had most of the season broken.

Caitlin Reilly (26:15): Right.

Alfred Gough (26:15): But when you get to step away from something and then really think about it, we kind of rearranged a little bit of the season and we had an episode that we needed to fill, and we wanted to do something that really showcased Enid and Wednesday, and really kind of talked about their friendship. And that's where the idea for the Body Swap came. Because they're such, I mean, they're both fantastic actresses, but they have such specific characters that it felt like watching the other play them would be great.

Miles Millar (26:46): It's the delicious Freaky Friday element. It's such a, I mean, to see them play each other. We just thought that would be amazing and that people would be ready for that in terms of they are so iconic in terms of their personalities. It just felt like, oh, that would be a great, great, and it was a challenge in terms. That would be a great end. It was a challenge in terms of getting the method of how that'd swap to feel believable in this world. They don't really do magic in the show.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): Wednesday. We have to go back.

[CLIP] Female Voice (27:23): There would be a price to pay.

Caitlin Reilly (27:29): So what was it like to see Emma and Jenna switch spots? Did you see them do any preparation? Were they working on this together?

Miles Millar (27:36): They did a lot of preparation.

Alfred Gough (27:37): They did. They did. The director of that episode was Angela Robinson, and she worked a lot with both of them. So they did a lot of preparation and really studied each other. And there were moments on set. I mean, especially with Jenna, where it's like, "If you closed my eyes, it sounded like Emma."

Caitlin Reilly (27:57): It did-

Alfred Gough (27:57): There was a couple of things-

Caitlin Reilly (27:58): ... you know what?

Alfred Gough (28:00): ... I was just like, "Oh my, is that Emma?" And then it was amazing.

Caitlin Reilly (28:00): Well, what I first thought is they were dubbing each other.

Alfred Gough (28:02): Yeah, no.

Caitlin Reilly (28:03): That's, yeah.

Alfred Gough (28:05): Yeah, I know. They did an amazing job.

Caitlin Reilly (28:06): Yeah, they really did.

Miles Millar (28:06): Yeah, and they'd watch each other's takes, and they'd correct each other. "Oh, I wouldn't do that. I would do this." So it was very, I mean, nothing accidental in terms of performances. It was just-

Alfred Gough (28:15): No, very-

Miles Millar (28:15): ... incredibly meticulous and they really had each others' backs in terms of protecting their own characters as well as helping each other. It was a really special episode.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Enid Sinclair): You don't know anything about me. You're just a sycophantic loser that I use from time to time when it's convenient. But we're not friends. I don't even like you. In fact, I wish you would just stay invisible, forever.

Caitlin Reilly (28:50): Agnes is such a fan favorite already. I mean, she comes in, saves the day. She's such a huge part of this season. Where did this idea for this character come from?

Miles Millar (29:01): Well, I mean, the idea of Agnes... We had this situation at the end of Season 1 where we had a stalker and we didn't actually know who the stalker was going to be until we got into the writer's room for Season 2. And we loved the idea of ... Because we saw it with the show, but their younger girls became obsessed with Wednesday.

Caitlin Reilly (29:18): Right.

Miles Millar (29:19): So we thought, "What if there's a young girl at Nevermore who, after the events of Season 1, the Crackstone situation, just idolized Wednesday, to a Wednesday extent." She's insane.

Alfred Gough (29:30): She's deranged.

Miles Millar (29:31): She's deranged.

Caitlin Reilly (29:31): Yeah. Love her. We love a deranged girlie.

Miles Millar (29:34): Yes. So that was the sort of inspiration. And then that she's fiendishly smart, and the idea she's invisible, which comes into play in this episode, where it's the emotional invisibility that she's a character who has never been seen, doesn't feel that she's respected or given the credit or agency that she deserves. And so this was about the idea that the rivalry between Enid and Agnes comes to the boil. And Enid as Wednesday really rails her. And the emotional heart of this episode is actually, Agnes is sort of feeling worthless and going to some of our parts of the therapy with Thing. And really it's I think, the most heartbreaking moment of the season, which is really, you get to understand who Agnes is and why she is who she is.

Alfred Gough (30:26): Yeah.

[CLIP] Evie Templeton (as Agnes DeMille): I thought at Nevermore I would finally be seen and have real friends, but the truth is I feel more invisible than ever.

[CLIP] Christopher Lloyd (as Professor Orloff): We want you to know that we all see you, Agnes. Make yourself at home.

Caitlin Reilly (30:57): What was it like seeing Evie bring Agnes to life?

Alfred Gough (31:00): It was amazing. I mean, to watch Evie do it and she has incredible eyes. It's just like those eyes. And she has this look where it's like she's sweet, but clearly deranged. So I think she just brought something to it, because the concern with that kind of character when she's sort of a Wednesday file is that it's going to feel like Wednesday light and she doesn't. She has a completely different energy to it.

Miles Millar (31:27): And also means the red hair was a big deal. So when we see the three of them together, you sort of got iconically Wednesday and then you have Redhead Agnes, then you have Enid with the blonde sort of rainbow look. So it's just like they feel very distinct. But it was definitely like Colleen Atwood, who's the costume designer really working on that look to make it feel distinct from everybody else. And now the audition process, we saw a huge number of people and we were very conscious of finding someone who was young, who wasn't like a 23-year-old playing 12, that she was a young teenager who felt younger than either-

Alfred Gough (32:04): Wednesday or Enid.

Miles Millar (32:04): Yeah. So it was that sort of looking up at them.

[CLIP] Evie Templeton (as Agnes DeMille): Admit it. You're a little impressed.

[CLIP] Emma Myers (as Enid Sinclair): I can't believe we were almost perforated by your fangirl Mini-me. Why don't I return the favor?

[CLIP] Evie Templeton (as Agnes DeMille): Park your claws, rainbow Barbie. Besides, I got you some alone time with a pack hottie. You're welcome.

[CLIP] Jenna Ortega (as Wednesday Addams): You almost burned my novel at the Founder's Pyre.

[CLIP] Evie Templeton (as Agnes DeMille): Oh, that was just an appetizer. This was the main course.

Caitlin Reilly (32:34): So by the end of this episode, Wednesday has saved Enid, but her vision has changed. Now an Addams will die. How did you arrive at the twist and what path will this new revelation put Wednesday on?

Alfred Gough (32:47): We came to the twist because we wanted to frankly change it up. We didn't want to think, oh, the whole season is just going to be this. And it really puts the focus firmly back on the family.

Caitlin Reilly (32:57): Right.

Miles Millar (32:58): Yeah. It felt like we always knew what the season was going to end. So it felt like through the season, that was the point, to twist it and start directing us towards the end.

Caitlin Reilly (33:07): Well, thank you so much, Al and Miles, thank you for coming to my house. This was the longest-

Alfred Gough (33:13): We love what you've done with the place.

Miles Millar (33:13): Yes.

Caitlin Reilly (33:13): Thank you so much.

Alfred Gough (33:14): Delightful.

Caitlin Reilly (33:15): Really, this is where I hold all of my auditions, so I'll be hearing from you.

Alfred Gough (33:20): Great.

Miles Millar (33:20): Thanks so much.

Alfred Gough (33:20): Thank you.

Caitlin Reilly (33:21): Great, thank you.

Alfred Gough (33:28): Okay.

[GFX: Next time on… the Wednesday Season 2 Official Woecast]

Caitlin Reilly (33:28): We've still got two more episodes to go with the absolute superstar guests, including Evie Templeton, everyone's new fave who plays Wednesday's creepy but lovable stalker, Agnes DeMille.

Evie Templeton: I love the obsessive nature of the character, and that was something that I could really take on board with Agnes.

Caitlin Reilly (33:46): Yes. And I will be joined by the one and only Steve Buscemi playing the Despicable Principal Dort.

Steve Buscemi (33:54): Been such a fan of the Addams family since I was a kid. And now here I am acting with the whole family.

Caitlin Reilly (34:01): And hold onto your hats. Costume genius Colleen Atwood is here to discuss all of the looks from the school gala. Iconic.

Colleen Atwood (34:11): The costume lit itself, which sometimes you have to do in this world.

Caitlin Reilly (34:15): Yeah, that's what's coming up on the next episode of the Wednesday Season 2 Official Woecast. I'm Caitlin Reilly. Until next time, my little storm clouds.